the testing restrictions are absurd!

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the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flip Flapper on Mon Dec 29, 2014 1:42 am

i understand that the tester cant use thoose decks (baring dragons) but the testee should be allowed to use whatever s/he wants! what if their main deck is lock or control? i agree that the tester shouldnt use them (again, barring dragon) but i think the testee should, also there was a recruit who lost a lot of points becuse "there was not much startegy involved in locking out" the ****? burn is also a completely legit deck, there is more to the game then beating your opponet down with stronger monsters, i personally have the guilty pleasure of mill decks and they are also legit, just becuse the majority of players doesnt use them you shouldnt dismiss all of these decks as "troll decks" (except thoose insane weird OTKs imo) every one will duel them sooner or later and what are you gonna do then? call the judge/admin and say that your opponet uses a troll deck and should be banned? i understand it being boring once you cant make your move at all but thoose locks are hard, and burning all of your opponets life points to 0
in one turn is hard to

i know that you wont care about this so i just wasted a bunch of time but please THINK about it instead of just "they dont do the same thing every one does they are trolls!!!!!"

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flip Flapper on Mon Dec 29, 2014 1:43 am

to be fair though i assume you put a LITTLE more thought into it before you called it troll deck, but probably while raging after a lost to it.......

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 10:50 am

Umm, by troll decks we mean stuff thats built only to annoy people, and btw, when Lint said Dragons, he did NOT specify. What Lint meant was E Dragon AKA Dragon Ruler. Locks don't test the skill of the opponent, or let the tester even TEST. Burn is just annoying Stardust, and you have NO CLUE how much people hate it, because it is no fun to play or play AGAINST. Mill-Focused decks? Now heres the thing, they rely on luck, not skill, to make their plays. Lightsworn are luck-sack. Mill decks that are focused on decking the opponent out are no fun to go against, and again, luck-based.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flip Flapper on Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:44 am

i agree that the TESTER should NOT be allowe dto use them, but the testee should, if that is their main deck then it is, it do take skill altough less, i dont consider lightsworn mill becuse milling yourself is sucidal, and im just stating my oppinion here, i go with the desicion the admins choose but i disagree with what it is now

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flint on Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:32 pm

Menial, dueling should be a test of strategy and the use of cards and it's very hard to test that when your opponent is using Exodia. How can you gauge skill when all you do is draw and stall? There is none. Many of the decks listed (Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown) don't gauge skill, are annoying and are all around dumb. I don't mean singular cards, I am talking about entire decks. If you'd like to tech Wave-Motion Cannon or make a pressure deck where half of the deck is burn to pressure your opponent into plays, that's completely fine. I'm talking about decks that take an absurd amount of time to end and make sure they prevent any way of taking damage ie. Stall.

When I say lockdown decks, I mean legitimate lockdown decks, not something like Greg's deck where it was challenging to get over because he was protecting his monster. I'm talking about something like White Dragon Ninja and Safe Zone or some other legitimate lockdown deck where you have almost no options against combating it the those options aren't the most common ones.

Troll decks are decks that serve no purpose other than to make the tester irritated or angered. I don't consider Ojama, Skull Servant or any assortment of gimmicky decks "troll". Troll decks are something like using Convulsion of Nature or Darkness Approaches on DN when there is no possible way to flip your deck upside down or flip a monster face-down in ATK position and the person using these cards is only doing this to piss off the tester. Also, I did not lose to a troll deck before writing this, drop the ad-hominem.

Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown do not gauge skill, are extremely linear and if they were legal for use, the testee would be deducted massive points for have a linear strategy, no originality and pretty much no reaction since most of these decks don't run protection traps but more rather traps that only run further the purpose of their alternative wins. Basically, IF they were legal, they would pretty much be in Underworld if they used these decks.

I put Dragons restricted for Testers mainly because of the massive support Dragons have. If you'd like to tech dragons in a non-Dragon deck, you are free to do so. Six Samurai I added there mainly because Shadow told me. Not really a giant or elaborate reason further than "Shadow told me." We put more restrictions to the testers mainly to balance out the test results. It would be somewhat peculiar to write test results when the tester is using a meta deck, the testee is free to use meta decks but would be deducted points.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:38 pm

You see, my Six Sams that I have been playing play a legitamate lockdown/OTK strategy, if you haven't noticed. I've made even Qli's, BA and Shaddolls helpless against my Sams. Also, I tested one member with the Sams, and it was no contest. He legit COULD NOT PLAY against them.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flip Flapper on Mon Dec 29, 2014 2:34 pm

Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown do not gauge skill, are extremely linear and if they were legal for use, the testee would be deducted massive points for have a linear strategy, no originality and pretty much no reaction since most of these decks don't run protection traps but more rather traps that only run further the purpose of their alternative wins. Basically, IF they were legal, they would pretty much be in Underworld if they used these decks.

if they run that we have to test them in that, it would be like i told shadow that he cant play blackwings, or you that you cant play worm, or if some one told azmain he cant use his photons, a persons deck is a part of you, taking that away from them is not right, they get enough hate for using them as it is, and no matter what you think it takes skill, less then other decks but it still takes more skill then something like qliphort and that isnt banned, the only time i saw a different qli deck was the one i made that used monarchs, all the others look nearly identical, i thought we supported people using non meta decks, if burn/stall/lock/mill wasnt legit konami wouldnt have made the cards at all, no offence to any one here but this is just stupid...... as i said robbing people from their favorite deck is low, ill go with the admins desicion though but i want to here azmain´s thoughs on it first

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:05 pm

menial, you are taking it as if we are trying to take away decks that we dont like! We have REASONS for this! Decks that are focused on trolling like with Convulsion, and etc are just there 99.99% of the time to piss people off! We arent trying to take LEGITIMATE DECKS out of the equation! The whole point of the test is to gauge skill and knowledge, and what you are taking all of this in as is robbing people of their originality, which we are NOT. Dont assume things so fast.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:10 pm

Also, are you kidding me? Tell me, how does it take skill to play Lightsworn? How does it take skill to play Final Countdown or Exodia? It doesn't! Those are luck-sack decks that don't have legitimate strategies other than stalling, drawing, getting lucky mills, etc.! If somebody beat me with Exodia, I would indeed be surprised, but for lack of originality, they would most likely get Underworld or lower Black Chaos. Also, the testee using any stall/lock decks stops the tester from EFFECTIVELY DOING HIS JOB and TESTING the testee!

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flint on Mon Dec 29, 2014 10:00 pm

"if they run that we have to test them in that, it would be like i told shadow that he cant play blackwings, or you that you cant play worm, or if some one told azmain he cant use his photons, a persons deck is a part of you, taking that away from them is not right, they get enough hate for using them as it is, and no matter what you think it takes skill, less then other decks but it still takes more skill then something like qliphort and that isnt banned, the only time i saw a different qli deck was the one i made that used monarchs, all the others look nearly identical, i thought we supported people using non meta decks, if burn/stall/lock/mill wasnt legit konami wouldnt have made the cards at all, no offence to any one here but this is just stupid...... as i said robbing people from their favorite deck is low, ill go with the admins desicion though but i want to here azmain´s thoughs on it first[/quote]" -Menial

People do not play Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown because they like it, people play it because it is a cheap, skill-less win. Also, how could to compare Blackwing, Worms and Photon to Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown? Blackwing, Worms and Photon are legitimate decks, Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown are degenerate decks that results in little player interaction, no skill and generally annoys everyone.

Menial, you question how it's wrong to take away someone's favorite deck (Not very likely someone's favorite deck is Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown) but don't question how wrong it is to have no player interaction? How much player interaction is there from drawing and stalling (Exodia)? How much player interaction is there from burning and stalling? (Burn)? How much player interaction is there from dumb lockdowns? The answer is none. Not to mention that most of these decks aren't any different. They're all the same; with the exception of lockdowns but it doesn't exclude that these decks result in one-sided player interaction.

Cicada3301 put it nicely into a couple sentences. "YuGiOh is supposed to be a game with 2 opponents. It isn't fair nor is it congenial when 1 player is playing solitaire and the other player is sitting down?"

YuGiOh should have player interaction between 2 people. Plain and simple and the decks that have been restricted from use for testees is eliminating 1 player interaction. I don't care if someone's favorite deck is Exodia/Burn/Stall/Lockdown, but if they are using it to take away from playing someone else's favorite deck from the lack of player interaction; it's not legitimate for use.

We're putting these restrictions because we want to eliminate one-sided player interaction, skill-less duels and all around annoyances. Unless you can debate on how these decks do not result in; one-sided player interactions, result in cheap/skill-less wins and are all built the same with little to no originality, they aren't legitimate for testees.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:44 pm

Umm, Dark World isn't considered degenerate or trolly right? That is actually among my favorites

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flint on Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:49 pm

Dark World is a legitimate deck. Troll is abusing the mechanics on DN that can't be used. There is a difference between someone who just hates playing against Dark Worlds and then there is something like using troll cards that don't work on DN like Exchange, Convulsion of Nature and Darkness Approaches for the sole and only purpose of pissing someone off.

Dark Worlds are safe.

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Mon Dec 29, 2014 11:49 pm

Smile Yay

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Flip Flapper on Tue Dec 30, 2014 1:27 am

We're putting these restrictions because we want to eliminate one-sided player interaction

ok, i see your point now

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Re: the testing restrictions are absurd!

Post by Kira Yoshikage on Tue Dec 30, 2014 1:39 pm

It takes some time to set up, you take damage from your own cards and so on. People mock DDD's because they are a risk-reward playstyle to the core.

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